tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post4105192170696312151..comments2023-12-02T00:38:46.467-08:00Comments on House Hunt Victoria: HST results are inHouseHuntVictoriahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07456914359088891317noreply@blogger.comBlogger59125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-7366413345569229752011-08-29T10:31:30.716-07:002011-08-29T10:31:30.716-07:00@Leo S: See, that's what I'm talking about...@Leo S: See, that's what I'm talking about. It's not about "punishment", or petty revenge. Framing the anti-HST view as a bunch of angry vengeful people, or people who are upset about "how the HST was introduced", or who are upset about the "bad optics", or are financially illiterate, is demeaning, patronizing, and misses the point.<br /><br />There was real affront to democracy here. Legislation enacted in direct contravention of the election platform (which handed the government a majority), pushed through what can be charitably described as an abridged process, something that we now can see was clearly planned way ahead of time... voters have the right to get rid of this legislation, and have it run through the proper process we have in place to pass new legislation, including debate in the legislature, public consultation, and economic studies, BEFORE it is signed into law, not after.<br /><br />Why do we even have the trappings of democracy, when we happily ignore them on such a major issue? Get rid of the whole thing, save billions of dollars, because it's all about the bottom line after all, isn't it? We can just have the nice smart people in Victoria tell us what is good for us, and then go ahead and do it.<br /><br />Like I said earlier, sticking to your principles is rarely cheaper or faster than doing it the easy way, but it is always in your long term best interest.<br /><br />And this topic is about HST and HST only, so I don't think it's unreasonable that HST discussion dominates.pod_xhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15563878261558272350noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-49364243317403869722011-08-28T18:55:22.570-07:002011-08-28T18:55:22.570-07:00"This characterization is blatant fear monger...<i>"This characterization is blatant fear mongering."</i><br /><br />In your mind, sure, whatever.<br /><br />In the minds of us who have done some math, read some actual economic reports, the kind real economists wrote, it's just the closest thing to the unemotional truth available. <br /><br />But I already well know how much you value that, so let's move on...HouseHuntVictoriahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07456914359088891317noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-58398372358543447652011-08-28T18:47:25.527-07:002011-08-28T18:47:25.527-07:00Frannie,
The scientific consensus is still that s...Frannie,<br /><br />The scientific consensus is still that smart meters are not dangerous. Further, people opposed to smart meters are doing themselves a huge disservice by allying themselves with The Crazies.<br /><br />There are actual reasons to oppose smart meters but they are never brought up. Oh no, it's always they cause cancer, autism and bed wetting. They will let BC hydro monitor your sex toy usage. Hackers will be able to break into your computer and see if you are on vacation. Blah, blah, blah.<br /><br />Tell you what. Come up with some sort of plausible basis for why they're dangerous and what they're doing. Throwing every disease at the wall and seeing what sticks isn't going to cut it. Then show actual harm in an animal model with typical doses. Bet you a beer that any studies showing any effect would follow Crislip's LawMark Robinsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04060685664598918685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-36088790062898183032011-08-28T18:25:36.774-07:002011-08-28T18:25:36.774-07:00like academic researchers
Unlike the pope, academ...<i>like academic researchers</i><br /><br />Unlike the pope, academic researchers are not infallible. Especially when its just a couple against the majority.<br /><br /><i>the World Health Organization, ring the alarm bells</i><br /><br />That would be interesting if they were, but they aren't. Please link to the WHO report where they ring the alarm bells about smart meters in particular.<br /><br /><i>But of course, if Hydro and the FCC say it's OK, then, it must be OK, right?</i><br /><br />Not must, but it's a pretty good indication, since the FCC regs are based on the prevailing scientific consensus about safe exposure levels. But by all means, believe some lone researcher out of left field instead.<br /><br /><i>A recent CBC report indicated how divided the scientific community is on this.</i><br /><br />Your argument would be helped if you actually linked to things you reference. All I could find was this: <a href="http://www.cbc.ca/news/story/2010/10/26/con-smart-meters.html" rel="nofollow">Clever use of smart meters saves energy</a><br /><br /><i>Dismissing all the arguments of others because "you can find evidence of anything if you look for it" doesn't make the points they make less valid. </i><br /><br />True. The point was that just because some guy with a phd makes a claim, that doesn't make it true.<br /><br />"Smart meters cause health problems" is an extraordinary claim to make, since it goes against the consensus on safe radiation levels. So to make that claim you need extraordinary evidence. The burden is on the anti-smart meter side to provide that evidence, not the other way around.<br /><br /><i>And again, where were those savings we were supposed to get? Oh, nobody else who has put them in has experienced any savings?</i><br /><br />That's at least a sensible point of concern. I don't know anything about what studies have been done so can't argue one way or another whether that claim is true or not.Leo Shttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02951281972056927807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-16341933563062503392011-08-28T18:13:49.667-07:002011-08-28T18:13:49.667-07:00One interesting thing to consider, when people ins...One interesting thing to consider, when people insist that because current evidence of harm is not conclusive, therefore something is safe, is history.<br /><br />For instance.<br /><br />Asbestos<br />Lead Paint<br />Leaded gasoline<br />Cigarette smoking<br />Taking drugs while pregnant (many women in the fifties and sixties had some pretty interesting prescriptions)<br />Drinking while pregnant (as recently as the 80s, doctors were suggesting wine with dinner to pregnant women--it was perfectly safe)<br /><br />I'm afraid I'm not persuaded by the "they must have been doing it wrong" argument regarding the higher-than-advertised emissions readings.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-50328890643982059142011-08-28T17:33:32.015-07:002011-08-28T17:33:32.015-07:00"The thing about this kind of evidence is tha..."The thing about this kind of evidence is that you can find it for anything."<br /><br />So that means, evidence means nothing? We can just dismiss all of it because it's all meaningless?<br /><br />When evidence continues to build and build, and credible sources, like academic researchers, and the World Health Organization, ring the alarm bells, I believe it's time to pay attention. But of course, if Hydro and the FCC say it's OK, then, it must be OK, right?<br /><br />A recent CBC report indicated how divided the scientific community is on this. Hydro is relying on partial and old research. <br /><br />As I said, it's easy to dismiss arguments and evidence you don't want to see, and say, "Oh, the scientific community says X," even when that is clearly not true. And I am not personally offended (like anyone would care what an internet commenter said about them). I'm just pointing out that it's not a very effective strategy. <br /><br />Dismissing all the arguments of others because "you can find evidence of anything if you look for it" doesn't make the points they make less valid. <br /><br />As I said, believe what you choose. But I think people deserve to see all the evidence, all the arguments, and decide for themselves. And regardless, Hydro is still forcing this technology on people who don't want it, and we are the ratepayers. Going off grid is just not an option for most. And again, where were those savings we were supposed to get? Oh, nobody else who has put them in has experienced any savings?<br /><br />Pity.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-68471704433151719772011-08-28T17:33:30.758-07:002011-08-28T17:33:30.758-07:00828 is very lucky. My impression is that oak bay ...828 is very lucky. My impression is that oak bay sales are picking up, which is the opposite of what usually happens this time of year.omchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11570216584047858772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-38128173528805622032011-08-28T17:28:44.824-07:002011-08-28T17:28:44.824-07:00HHV,
Please post a new REAL ESTATE topic. WiFi an...HHV,<br /><br />Please post a new REAL ESTATE topic. WiFi and HST debates are taking over your blog.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-62883772846743079722011-08-28T17:04:51.274-07:002011-08-28T17:04:51.274-07:00So...828 Hampshire finally sold. The owner must b...So...828 Hampshire finally sold. The owner must be relieved. And for almost 100K than they initially wanted if I remember correctly.a simple manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13054677016369304449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-76425502661909456632011-08-28T15:56:26.542-07:002011-08-28T15:56:26.542-07:00I should clarify that an "order of magnitude&...I should clarify that an "order of magnitude" is a factor of 10.jessehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02155122147972263497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-9946054129678500632011-08-28T15:52:40.824-07:002011-08-28T15:52:40.824-07:00Here is Hydro One's commissioned report on the...<a href="http://www.hydroone.com/MyHome/MyAccount/MyMeter/Documents/Smart_Meters_Report_on_RFE.pdf" rel="nofollow">Here</a> is Hydro One's commissioned report on the radiation hazard. It's not about what I personally "think" or "feel" about the situation; the body of scientific evidence indicates there are more pressing things to worry about, as Leo has indicated.<br /><br />Amazing though how the internet is littered with FUD on the matter, though if one follows 95% of the links against smart meters, they seem to point to the same 2 or 3 reports. The single link I provided above has a slightly larger citation base at its disposal, by an order of magnitude.<br /><br />But please continue the debate.jessehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02155122147972263497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-45880259676861295212011-08-28T15:39:56.431-07:002011-08-28T15:39:56.431-07:00Actually Leo, Dr. Johansson's field of researc...<i>Actually Leo, Dr. Johansson's field of research expertise is electromagnetic field radiation. So yes, he is an expert in it.</i><br /><br />Indeed. Along with the dangers of smart meters he also talks about how you might get "screen dermatitis" from sitting in front of a computer or TV. Hope you don't have one of those.<br /><br /><i>And where is the "proof" that this is safe?</i><br /><br />In that the smart meters have been FCC approved to fall within the guidelines for emitted radiation. <br /><br /><i> this is both a matter of load (as in, we are all exposed to more and more radiation of this kind all the time)</i><br /><br />Ok, but smart meters will add only a tiny additional load. The proliferation of wifi and cell phones added thousands of times more. So why the exaggerated concern about this?<br /><br /><i>It is the spikes that are the concern. In addition, the Itron and Hydro-cited radiation levels are not what people going out to field to measure these things are finding.</i><br /><br />Then those people out in the field are either measuring incorrectly, measuring signal from another source, or full of poop. The devices would not be FCC approved if they emitted "spikes" above the allowed levels. <br /><br /><i>Again, it's your choice whether to give all this evidence any credence.</i><br /><br />The thing about this kind of evidence is that you can find it for anything. Commercial airliners are spraying mind-control chemicals on us? There are thousands of sites full of "evidence" for that. The illuminati control the banking system? Again, thousands of sites full of all sorts of evidence. Obama is born in Africa? Absolutely, there are hundreds of hours of youtube video proving that to be the case, based on expert analysis of his birth certificate. <br />There are people out there to support just about any nutty idea you could think of. Perpetual motion machines, cars that run on water, cold fusion. All those things have been demonstrated by so-called experts and documented with excruciating detail on the internet. And yet all of them also never seem to be scientifically tested by a third party (inevitably there's a good reason for this).<br /><br /><i>One of things one observes, if one follows blogs, is how easy some find it to use sarcasm to denigrate, dismiss or attempt to humiliate those who think differently from themselves</i><br /><br />Actually I'm using sarcasm to denigrate and dismiss the concept of smart meters being dangerous to our health. You might feel personally offended at that, but it's not directed at you at all.Leo Shttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02951281972056927807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-29422496468786872602011-08-28T15:32:46.872-07:002011-08-28T15:32:46.872-07:00"how easy some find it to use sarcasm to deni...<i>"how easy some find it to use sarcasm to denigrate, dismiss or attempt to humiliate those who think differently from themselves"</i><br /><br />Apologies, Frannie. We usually reserve sarcasm for the most inane of arguments. I guess your treatise citing one physician, never mind the mountain of peer reviewed evidence to the exact contrary, must have fallen through my mental cracks.<br /><br />Oh was that sarcasm again? I can't tell any more.jessehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02155122147972263497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-73846859411244426412011-08-28T15:29:16.625-07:002011-08-28T15:29:16.625-07:00I completely understand that the people sent the g...<em>I completely understand that the people sent the government a message. But that message came at a huge cost to the people. A long-term cost that will not only damage BC's economy and the pocket books of everyone living here, be they business owner or employee, government worker, retiree or welfare recipient, but it will also continue to damage BC's economy and drive investment away from the province to jurisdictions that have addressed inefficient taxation better than BC has.</em><br /><br />This characterization is blatant fear mongering.Introverthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03333045260631104757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-34110300489699665102011-08-28T14:49:53.060-07:002011-08-28T14:49:53.060-07:00One of things one observes, if one follows blogs, ...One of things one observes, if one follows blogs, is how easy some find it to use sarcasm to denigrate, dismiss or attempt to humiliate those who think differently from themselves, from behind the safety and anonymity of a computer screen. There's a great show about this very thing going on at the Victoria Fringe Festival. It's called "The Disinhibition Effect."<br /><br />It is, of course, simpler to do this than to take the time to do the research oneself. Or perhaps it's a matter of not wanting to have one's faith in something one believes to be honest, good or benign, like, for example, the BC government, or wireless technology, challenged. (Oh my goodness, was that sarcasm?)<br /><br />It's not unlike the reactions one often gets when one suggests that housing prices in Victoria might not go up forever.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-62217237373219745642011-08-28T14:26:06.930-07:002011-08-28T14:26:06.930-07:00Actually Leo, Dr. Johansson's field of researc...Actually Leo, Dr. Johansson's field of research expertise is electromagnetic field radiation. So yes, he is an expert in it.<br /><br />And where is the "proof" that this is safe? In Hydro's press releases? And as many who study this have pointed out, this is both a matter of load (as in, we are all exposed to more and more radiation of this kind all the time), and spikes, which the smart meters produce. It is the spikes that are the concern. In addition, the Itron and Hydro-cited radiation levels are not what people going out to field to measure these things are finding. the radiation being emitted is far higher than what is being quoted.<br /><br />Again, it's your choice whether to give all this evidence any credence. But it is not my choice, apparently, to be able to say no to this technology, when I do take such evidence seriously.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-54217681464390062632011-08-28T14:19:00.925-07:002011-08-28T14:19:00.925-07:00@jesse. Oh yeah I heard that too. Well maybe it ...@jesse. Oh yeah I heard that too. Well maybe it was just now from you, but it sounds right.<br /><br />Also this guy on the internet had a smart meter installed and the next day he had a headache. That's all the proof I need.Leo Shttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02951281972056927807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-23529116605170921242011-08-28T14:17:50.839-07:002011-08-28T14:17:50.839-07:00but Smart Meters are not wifi
Correct. Wifi is e...<i>but Smart Meters are not wifi</i><br /><br />Correct. Wifi is exposing you to much more radiation. Your smart meter is not even transmitting anything 99% of the time.<br /><br /><i>and they are serious.</i><br /><br />Nope.<br /><br /><i>Dr. Olle Johansson of the Department of Neuroscience, Karolinska Institute, Sweden, writing to California public utilities</i><br /><br />It appears being a Dr of Neuroscience does not make you an expert on electromagnetic radiation. Surprise surprise.<br /><br /><i>And the point is, I have a choice how, when and if to use my cell phone</i><br /><br />Not really. Assuming you own a somewhat modern cell phone, it will be emitting radiation throughout the day, no matter if you use it or not. Same with your wireless router. Hope you don't have a microwave, now that's really bad.<br /><br /><i>I just think establishing a billion dollar program with technology that has not been proven safe, and about which there are indeed very grave scientific concerns, and removing it from any level of public oversight is WRONG.</i><br /><br />I agree. Except in this case there is no credible concern at all. It has been proven safe, at least as safe as any other low-power wireless device we are surrounded by every day. They don't need to be individually proven safe, because they comply to FCC regulations that have been deemed safe. Just like anything else. http://www.sdge.com/campaigns/smartmeter/rf_concerns.htmlLeo Shttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02951281972056927807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-57208445544570225842011-08-28T13:47:16.070-07:002011-08-28T13:47:16.070-07:00I heard smart meters are linked to a higher risk o...I heard smart meters are linked to a higher risk of autism development in newborns. Actually I didn't her that, but it hasn't been completely refuted either. Think of the children, people. Say no to smart meters.jessehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02155122147972263497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-28185751581402525842011-08-28T13:44:33.350-07:002011-08-28T13:44:33.350-07:00Oh, another little thing about Smart Meters is tha...Oh, another little thing about Smart Meters is that the Clean Energy Act, which requires them, removed the program from all oversight by the BC Utilities Commission. <br /><br />Sorry, am I being a conspiracy theorist? I just think establishing a billion dollar program with technology that has not been proven safe, and about which there are indeed very grave scientific concerns, and removing it from any level of public oversight is WRONG. If that makes me a conspiracy theorist, so be it. I'll wear it proudly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-49221006877520796862011-08-28T13:35:28.402-07:002011-08-28T13:35:28.402-07:00Well, sorry not to be so easily persuaded by the B...Well, sorry not to be so easily persuaded by the BC Hydro bafflegab, but Smart Meters are not wifi, and they are serious. Here's a quotation from Dr. Olle Johansson of the Department of Neuroscience, Karolinska Institute, Sweden, writing to California public utilities:<br /><br />"Many smart meters are close to beds, kitchens, playrooms, and similar locations. These wireless systems are never off, and the exposure is not voluntary. The smart meters are being forced on citizens everywhere. Based on this, the inauguration of smart meters with grudging and involuntary exposure of millions to billions of human beings to pulsed microwave radiation should immediately be prohibited until ’the red flag’ can be hauled down once and for all.<br /><br />The recent determination of the World Health Organization (WHO) to include radiofrequent radiation on the 2B list of carcinogens also applies to devices such as smart meters. Already September 4, 2008, the European Parliament voted 522 to 16 to recommend tighter safety standards for cell phones (Europ. Parl. resolution on the mid-term review of the European Environment and Health Action Plan 2004-2010). In light of the growing body of scientific evidence implicating cell phone use with brain tumors, the Parliament said, "The limits on exposure to electromagnetic fields [EMFs] which have been set for the general public are obsolete." The European Parliament "was greatly concerned at the Bioinitiative international report concerning EMFs, which summarises over 1500 studies on that topic and which points in its conclusions to the health risks posed by emissions from mobile-telephony devices such as mobile telephones, UMTS, WiFi, WiMax and Bluetooth, and also DECT landline telephones, and now it is again – and more firmly and seriously - repeated in the form of WHO’s recent cancer classification."<br /><br />And the point is, I have a choice how, when and if to use my cell phone, etc., but Hydro isn't giving us a choice about this. And by the way--those savings? Other jurisdictions have discovered they are non-existent. The state of Idaho chose a wired version of the technology, and it looks like California will soon have court-ordered opt out. <br /><br />And yes, this is about real estate, because those of us who are renting will be much more vulnerable, and have less of a voice, than those who own. This is a civil liberties issue, for all that many people are buying into the government's current attempt to paint dissenters as "cranks."<br /><br />So, any blog readers who would like to learn more, and consider refusing their consent to this unproven technology can visit the <a rel="nofollow">Citizens For Safe Technology</a> site to find out more.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-43529941743730257132011-08-28T11:34:35.306-07:002011-08-28T11:34:35.306-07:00"There is no sound economic argument in favou...<i>"There is no sound economic argument in favour of a PST/GST combination rather than an HST."</i><br /><br />There is some argument that BC is better served with a provincially-controlled tax policy. I'm all for harmonizing the collection and administrative portions of these taxes, but why not harmonize them and keep all the old exemptions first? Oh right because the federal government limited the exemptions.<br /><br />The big thing that irked many people, rage with the incumbent government aside, was that even after Campbell was turfed the no campaigners pussy-footed around the fact the HST was a tax increase. Couple that with stagnant wages, reduced hours, and high unemployment for the lower income tiers and it's not surprising people were suspicious. I think people are honestly looking to have those who benefited most, or at all, from a decade of reduced taxes "give a little back".jessehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02155122147972263497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-88025693545959183852011-08-28T10:59:39.285-07:002011-08-28T10:59:39.285-07:00I would say it is still relatively slow ~ probably...I would say it is still relatively slow ~ probably around 500 sales for the month. Average and median will jump. I think the rest of the year will outperform corresponding months from last year in terms of units sold - we will see.Markohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08315282480144281935noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-11774747957847139282011-08-28T10:52:47.781-07:002011-08-28T10:52:47.781-07:00Can't comment much on Vancouver's market l...Can't comment much on Vancouver's market lately. Our market is slowyl coming out of summer sleepiness. I had two listings in Delta last month and it was a different beast altogether. Multiple offers on both in the first days. Very, very different over there.Sweetrealtorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11643504502534685881noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7123542260692860177.post-57260918222230653872011-08-28T10:44:22.789-07:002011-08-28T10:44:22.789-07:00Oh god, don't start with the smart meter consp...<i>Oh god, don't start with the smart meter conspiracy theories </i><br /><br />I'm with you on this one Leo.<br /><br />Just what is a smart meter going to 'capture' of your private information in comparison to your ISP (Shaw/Telus) tracking your web traffic, Google tracking your searches, iPhones tracking your location, or Visa tracking your purchases? As far as I know, all the smart meter does is track electricity usage. Which they are doing already, just manually.<br /><br />And worryied about the safety of wifi devices? <br /><br />Better be willing to step out of the wireless world if that is the concern. <br /><br />Maybe drink only home brewed coffee (stay away from those wireless coffee houses), work from your house with wired phones and hard-wired internet, on 2 acres so that the neighbours wifi routers aren't reaching your home. Oh, and better skip the Ferries and take your own boat over to the mainland, wifi there too. And, lets not forget all of the wireless ATM's at concerts and corner stores, those wireless visa/debit card readers at restaurants, and those pesky new parking meters.<br /><br />Who knows, maybe wifi isn't totally safe. But it is absolutely everywhere already. BC Hydro isn't introducing anything new here. Just another wireless device in a world filling up with wireless devices.<br /><br />Now, the HST getting voted out? That was something truly new in our world that deserved our attention.Mindsethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16898125754772581488noreply@blogger.com